Interview with `Mike Mangini`

Mike , RoP

Mike, how do you like the Musik Messe Frankfurt so far ?

I like it very much, because you have the chance to meet the folks that work for Pearl and Zildjian and Remo over here, and these are the people I´m doing clinics for and with. It´s nice to have a face, you know, shake somebody’s hands, that´s the real important thing for me, those relationships. Playing this morning was interesting, as for me, it was 3 am this morning, it´s as if somebody woke you up in the middle of the night, but it was still fun as always!

You have been to the NAMM show I guess !? Can you compare the Frankfrut Musikmesse with the NAMM show ?

I can´t compare, cause I haven´t seen enough around here. I don´t know enough about the Frankfurt show, it seems like the same kind of thing. There are a lot of events at the NAMM show though in the surrounding areas. I think it´s a bigger kind of event, but I´m not sure ... I mean, this is great.

How can you play such complicated parts, and make fun of it ?

Well, firstly I hope it doesn´t sound complicated. Understand that I love puzzles; it makes me smile to figure them out; I ENJOY calculus problems...that ought to tell you something. Also, I can smile about it, cause I learned how to do it. I have to have confidence in order to make it entertaining and musical.I believe that the complicated playing, doesn´t sound very musical to most ears. It sounds complicated, and it means that a non musician might not enjoy that. It´s like ... you can have a friend, that´s not a musician, and if you ask who their favorite drummer is, they might say a drummer from a band that´s just very simple and straight ahead.

With the complicated playing, I don´t like how it sounds very much sometimes. I videotaped myself, and it seems like some of the patterns get so complex, that if a regular person was out there, that a regular person would hear it and say, that they didn´t think it was that good, because it sounds like a big mess. So I have to be careful with it, I do. Sometimes I lose track of it, I have fun, other times, I´m aware of how it sounds. When it is used in a special way, it is really, really great stuff to play. I ought to partly define "complicated" as playing at least one pattern that does not make it easier for the listener to know where the beat is. I wish there were not so many youtube clips of me of patterns and speed only; nobody ever puts up the groove stuff.

Could you describe how you got to be such a good drummer ? What did you practice when you were younger and gotten older, and did you always had a person to go to, to ask if it was correct or not ?

I developed myself, because I had somebody to go to from age 10 until the age of 18, and my drum teacher was a teacher who used to explain the "why" part. He would ask me to learn something, and what happened was, I developed a sense of perspective. Meaning, I understood that I was working on a code of nation thing for a while, and I had to go back to the speed thing and I had to go back and do musical things. But I always knew, where I was and that this is important, cause I didn´t feel lost, meaning, I wasn´t just working on speed and then I couldn´t play a song or I wasn´t just working on songs but then I really couldn´t play it, because I had to practice my mechanics. So he gave me a perspective. Now, after age 18, I had nobody to go to, so I had to figure out who I really became after that. So, I read. I read about the human mind, I read different philosophies, I read about the human brain, I read about the body; things that explain about how they do what they do. I studied academically. Because I studied academicly, it gave me purpose to my practicing, meaning; I knew that it was okay for me to rehearse the same thing six weeks straight, and only play that one thing, because I knew, that the human body would take a long time to learn. So I took my time to try to get skilled in different areas and I made sure to practice many different areas. It took a long time, it´s still taking time. It still takes time...

You are also a teacher at Berklee, do you give your students the way of learning that you experienced in your youth ?

Yes, I teach them exactly how I know how to learn. Because I advanced my body with certain limb combinations, or certain rhythms that I´ve earned. I earned them you know ? I can see where they are skill-wise. So, it´s easier to see for me, where they want to go and I always described them why we´re doing something, so that they choose to do it. And because they choose to practice what I ask, it´s meaningful and that´s what opens up long turn memory in the brain, as if something is meaningful.

I teach students that are jazz players, I teach students that are primarily rock players, as well as everything in between. And I never mess with who they wanna be. I don´t do stylistic adjustments unless they ask me. If a jazz student asks me to teach him how to be a better jazz player, I teach him the way I did, cause jazz was the first thing I really spent a long time learning when I was very young. So, primarily my background is the Beatles and Jazz. But, I know where 'they' are, so that makes me able to give them something that works. Again, I never mess with who they want to be. Many, not all, "Jazz only" teacher types are condescending to rock players because they think it is easy; they truly do not know how to hit hard and spot on a click for 5 minutes or 5 seconds. I'm sure a Jazz "only" person reading this would be offended unless they knew how I know this: clinic go'ers and students all over the World tell me what is said to them, what has been said to them and what they think will be said about them (negatively) by fellow students AND teachers. What a shame a couple bad apples can do this! After all, the student needs help knowing HOW to do something, not to be shown how to be an ignorant person, or told to listen to something and just "learn it." They don't know what to see, hear of feel in some cases!! They lack the talent to immediately get it, but they do not lack human skills to learn skills if properly taught and cared for on a personal level. A teacher that only 'shows' is not a teacher, they are a "show'er." What an abomination! There is an article written that slam me about my speed during a clinic??? Guess who would write an article about me that asks, "why use a Lamborgini to go to the grocery store?" Answer: an ignorant and rude fool who got to play in front of clinic crowd of over 4,000 people that I headlined. People like that make me ashamed of the "Jazz" stereotype because I love that music as much as anything. I know I would not be able to play what I play without it; but that is me, not everyone. In addition, I'm supposed to provide both musicality and entertainment right?? He and "they" don't write about all the slower sections of simple beats and spacious fills; selective memory at work. People want to see a whirlwind of unmusical, wicked fun, psycho-drum-hitting once in a while. I feel I have to start defending myself now; that's why I'm saying all this. My teacher ASKED me what I wanted to learn more of. I brought in Rush Hemispheres. He, mainly a jazz player, said wonderful things about Neil's playing. I wish more teachers were like him: combine what you think a person needs to learn, or has to learn in a curriculum, with 'who' they want to become as a player with a moderation. So yeah, I'm giving students what I experienced in my youth: a piece of my teacher.

How can I imagine your life when you were younger ? Did you always hang out in the practice romm ?

Yes, I had to quit sports and that really was hard for me to do. I am probably an athlete before I am a drummer. But I´ve been playing drums in public since I was five. So, maybe that statement isn´t quite correct .... but I mean in my mind, in my heart, I was always an athlete. And, when I became 15 or 16 years old, that´s when I had to make a decision to stop all the sports, because I knew that I wanted to be as good a drummer, as my mind knew was possible to anybody with the "calling" to do so. My mind knew it was possible for anybody like that to do it, and I still believe that to this day. I had to drop everything so I could practice from 1 o´clock in the afternoon until 11pm, every single day except sunday. On sundays, the family went to church, then we ate food and we watched sports or whatever and I wasn´t really allowed to go to the drums and disturb the family.

And you kept that way going for all these years ?

I haven´t practiced like that, since 1998, ten years ago was the last time I was able to practice fully. For now ... I practiced a little bit over the years, but I still haven´t practiced like I used to. I do need to, cause I´m learning some new combinations, and I know that if I haven´t learned the combinations, I can´t play it. Nobody can play everything.


Guys like Marco Minnemann and Virgil Donati know what I´m talking about with the side vs. side, multi-simultaneous patterns. I'm really happy for us all that they push physical boundries on the kit with it. That is, bar none, the hardest stuff to do, along with, trying to sound like another drummer. None of us but Charlie would sound perfect for the Stones!! There are so many great guys, great drummers that have become something; something they should not change just because other guys practice more or less 'stuff.' Everyone should follow their hearts, their " calling," and leave everyone else alone. Many groove "only" guys say negative things about the players who play more notes, unmusically in their eyes. That's not quite right in an absolute way, I don't think: I think most ears aren't trained to recognize some of the patterns. I think they don't like that they don't know what is being played; kind of like why progressive rock is not "pop"ular Rock. I think a non-musician would find a lot of notes and patterns unpleasant because they aren't in the know; the ear hasn't yet earned the privilege to find beauty in busier patterns.

Now, I need a lot of work on some new patterns, but fortunately, I´m able to get a little more time. I´m probably practicing 3.5 hours a week. I have no real time ... finishing my music is more important... raising a family, it´s too loud in the house and then I´m teaching the rest of the time and traveling for a clinic. I don´t wanna give the impression that I don´t practice at all, but I practiced right in front of you today. Couple of those patterns I played in the solo, I haven´t earned the privilege of being good at it yet. But when I´m gonna do it ? When am I ever gonna play it, if I don´t just dive it in front of the people, I´m not gonna get better at it. So, I will be working hard, and I´m hoping to get 2 hours in every other day and maybe one day in a long session this summer. If I could do that, I´d be very happy, but I wish, my life is such that I can practice all day, but I can´t, I can´t do it. I think guys like Mike Portnoy, Terry, Vinnie, Dennis, Kenny, Neil, ...good Lord, so many...Tommy Lee, Jeff Hamilton, Steve and Chad Smith, many Berklee drum colleagues, Tempesta, Mover, Horacio, Kollias, Longstreth, Alex Van Halen, the whole Gospel contingent, Singer, Gadd, Weckl, Vinnie Paul .... God I could keep going... I'm going to get in trouble for forgetting people! Anyway, these guys evoke images when thought of: that means they've become something. I only hope and pray that my pet project gets done for the World to hear so I can have some kind of musical place too. I know I have not communicated what I do, but will once I just get the right singer in my band...it is so close. Otherwise, I'd like a gig, like Ozzy, or Sabbath with Dio, where I can play right for great melodic songs, heavy guitar riffs and add in a crazy 4 min. solo to the show, light a gong on fire and smash it with my fist. Vinnie A. and Mike B. are great though...if they get can't make it...then OK :) People don't know me like that; what an ass I am for not putting that part of me out there so to speak. I don't like what people can do with youtube; I better get with it and use it.

Can you remember the first clinic you ever gave ? And can you compare it with your last clinic, where are the differences ?

Well, the differences are in my understanding and perspective in a clinic, meaning, the first clinic I did was over 3 hours long. I had diagrams, charts, I was talking and talking and playing and talking, I videotaped it and I was upset with myself because I just talked too much and it was just too long, it was complicated. So now the clinics are more focused and I´m a better teacher. I think I get better teaching every year. So, I can communicate something more quickly on stage.

Are clinics fun for you ?

Oh yes ... There´s nobody that tells me that I can´t do a long drumsolo. With a band I was always on a timer, there´s always somebody at the side of the stage yelling at me, to stop, well, not yelling but, giving me a signal. I wasn´t like I was gonna go over by too many minutes, but doing the clinics I can just gonna play, not worry about it. But, in fairness, if I´m in a band, if one person picks a solo, I don´t want to go too long, that´s not fair.

The time you dropped your other hobbies and decided for the drums, did you ever thought of doing something else than that, like learning a job or something ?

I did actually. I did not go to college for music, I went to college for computer software engineering. I left college to be a musician, because one of my professors pulled me aside after class and said: “Why are you in this school, I heard about your drumming !? You shouldn´t be here, go follow your heart !”. I quit school. I just went to my parents and said I wanna get out of here. I said, if the professor comes and tells me that, it means it´s gotta be true. It means I should go follow my dream. So, I ended up trying to make money as a musician, but it didn´t work all that well. The music as playing is too complicated, people won´t buy that, they don´t like it, you know? So I ended up in a job as a software engineer for about 4-5 years. And as I was working on the software I joined a band and a lot of people asked me for lessons, so I eventually started teaching and that was my job. I could probably be happy doing a lot of other things, but I´m supposed to be playing drums, I think I´m supposed to be playing drums.

When you got the fastest drummer of the world, how did you prepare yourself, how did you get your speed and your fitness ?

Well, let's just say I have some scientifically based facts that I can play a certain way for a certain length of time, faster than those who have tried it. I'm not the fastest drummer at controlling some urges to play a 13-tuplet on the part of my kit that makes an "M" shape, like my name, because I think it is funny. I'm not the fastest at a move that someone can play cleaner than me. However, I have to tell you that I didn´t prepare myself, I just learned it there. I learned it the day of the competition, I learned to do it because I had to; I already practiced the stamina part in my teenage years. The years I practiced quality with my hands, like on a pillow playing for long periods of time the same pattern and I´m able to really play at all tempos and control everything, with my hands. My feet are not like that, I rushed through some things with my feet. Not for long though :) There are some slower tempos actually that I have a hard time with. That´s just the truth, because I didn´t put so many years with that, but I had already told my arms how to move fast. My WFD preparation was becoming smart about how I worked. My preparation wasn´t playing at one speed for a minute putting the tempo up. When I broke the traditional grip record, I decided to do the matched grip record, that was only the second time I tried for one minute. I got 1180 or something. I promise you, I tried it, but I really couldn´t do it, because I was doing it the wrong way and then it came to me. I was warming up and I just tried a special thing with my arms, and it worked. So I went onstage and it was easy for me to play ... well, not easy, but I was able to do it.

Can you tell me something about your signature snare ? About sound, finish etc. ?

The Golden Ratio! Also, The purpose of the snare is it´s multi-functionality. Meaning, if you turn the snare off, it can act as a high tom, because I used to play with five toms in the center. And my mini snare was off to the side, and so, by having a deeper on at the middle, I just turn them off for the tom sound. That´s the main purpose. Secondly, I wanted it to be colored, so people can put it in their drumkit, that´s why it´s neutral grey. It works, it really works with the different colored kits. I also wanted it to be affordable ... and Pearl did extra things to it, it just came out so great, they just made it unbelievably solid and they really went above what I was expecting. But it´s multi functional, snare or tom, and a neutral color, so you can use it. Pearl listens to us, then they do research and follow though with the hard part! It is easy to come up with something and another to make it well.

How many times did you change your drumkit over the years ?

I changed it so much that all my drumtechs would always give me crap. I would just put something in a weird position one night, and they were like, “What are you doing ?” ... I don´t know, I´m making it interesting, that makes me focus more, or I'm gonna miss the cymbal. I just put something in a weird place. I did a gig once, with two roto toms, way up high and cymbals low. I find that to be quite funny.

Did you continue this experimental way ?

No, I´ve been using the same kind of basic clinic-set-up.

I guess you don´t have a lot of free time though. When you have some, what do you like to do ?

Well, I have a family now, so I have to do family stuff, I like to do that. I mean, just to hang out with my young son, that´s a lot of fun. We push trucks, and we hit drums and we throw a ball back and forth. We also make funny faces. I just try to teach him to hit things with both hands, to pushing the truck with both hands; he has fun with it. I could have fun in a gasoline throwing fight. Love playing cards, yelling at the TV during football and hockey season. My wife and I enjoy good food, good wine, movies, playing sports outside (when we can go out 4 months a year.) Seeing friends...lots of things. I shoot squirrels that chew on my house once in a while; that's fun.

What else do you plan for 2008 ?

Songwriting, recording, making a draft for Rhythm Knowledge 3....some other surprises :)

Do you have a lot of drumsets or shells at home ?

I have them stored. So, when gigs come up I choose the wood, and the set-up that I want.

Do you collect snaredrums or anything ?

No, I´m not like that. I´m not into that. I just like to play them, you know, when I started playing Pearl, they asked me a long time ago about a signature snare and my response to Pearl was, that I like the snares they have; I can´t come up with a better snare, I just want to play piles of theirs. And it was interesting, because when I was asked to do that, that´s an honor and a privilege to come like “hey, make a snaredrum”, but I said I can´t, I just don´t know, cause I like so many of your snaredrums. So after a few years of thinking about it and getting some advice, that´s why theauxiliary?snare is, because it´s different. It´s something that I use, it´s my sound.

Do you remember your drumsolo with Steve Vai ? It´s up on Youtube !?

It´s not supposed to be up on youtube! Well, I remember parts of it, I´m probably much to picky, I would not release that, but a lot of people like it and a lot of people have seen it; my feet stink in it. Yeah.... I remember it, I remember being really asleep and tired in the dressing room every stinking day; I remember sleeping right up until the show, I remember going onstage every night in my underwear, I did, I played in my underwear with a little shirt to cover myself because I sweat like crazy; I was sleeping; too many darn people on our bus; back up band; duffle bags; driver cranking tunes all night; sucked; nothing like the Fire Garden Tour- that was the best experience in history; what a thrill to want to be around Mike, Phil and Steve every night playing, then eating, then giggling about something, or watching something cool or funny. Just us and some cool techs; awesome.

Anyway, It´s definitely not one of my better solos, but it´s fun in parts; I wiped my forehead with each of my books to promote with humor.

Do you meet sometimes other professional drummers to jam or something ?

Almost never. If it´s preparing for a clinic, then yes. I had a real lot of fun doing that with Virgil Donati and Horacio Hernandez, cause we could play together during set up, and we can both (in each case) do things that we both like, it´s just really cool. I would love to do it more, with more drummers, any style, I think it´s great. But I don´t ... where can I do it you know ? How ? Life is to short. I did that once with Jonathan Mover years ago. I remember that clearly; that was fun; he just showed up, sat on this other drummer's kit in the room, and killed it. That made quite an impression on me; walk in and kill it. I did a festival with Bozzio; I heard him play the Black Page; completely different kit...but it WAS STILL HIM. I didn't dare jump on a kit to jam with him, so I sang the B. P. melody with a 1970's Vancouver Canucks hockey jersey on, while impersonating my friend Dana impersonating Ethel Merman. You had to be there; ask Terry. I never saw him giggle on stage before: I'll take that one to my grave in the front of my mind.

Over the years, did you play a drumset where you said that´s one kit you´d like to play forever ?

When I walked into the Pearl booth at NAMM in 1999, I hit a big floor tom, and it made my stomach move, and that´s why I´m playing the Pearl drums. I just hit one drum;Wow. So many great people making great gear; what a Time we live in.

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